How do I get from amateur to TikTok famous?

Moderator: 0:07

Hello, everyone. Welcome to our next q&a. Great to see such a big crowd here. So our next q&a is with Michael Le. And before he comes out, just want to remind everyone this is an interactive session. So make sure have your questions ready from we go around with our volunteers in the microphone. So a bit about our next speaker. So he's a social media dancing sensation and he has over 32 million TikTok followers alone, I don't even think I have 32. So he's b2b on that. And he now has his sights set on gaming and eSports. And he's here to talk about his company Joystick. So, get your questions ready. And everyone give a round of applause for Michael Le.

Michael Le: 0:49

Guys, Hi.

Moderator: 0:53

Thanks. Michael. First of all, welcome to Web Summit. I'm so would you like to tell the audience at Web Summit what you're here to talk about and why you're here?

Michael Le: 1:03

Yeah, I'm here to just make connections, share what I'm doing and hopefully provide you guys all the information that I've learned throughout my journey. And yeah, just really excited to be here. So thank you.

Moderator: 1:14

Great. So as I said, they're 52 million followers, which is a crazy amount, I think it's actually over that across your other social media channels, millions and millions and millions. So it's really a great achievement, especially for somebody so young, what could you tell the audience what are the best tips and tricks to build their following online? And how best they can market themselves?

Michael Le: 1:33

Oh, that's a good question. It's pretty broad. Um, I would say, social media now has changed throughout the last five years. I mean, honestly, it keeps changing every single year. And I think it's important right now that you look at 1) your niche and 2) what problems there are that you can solve yourself, you know. Social media back then, is completely different now. So you can't look back five years ago, or three years ago, even a year ago, and think that that would work now. Because there's so much more competition, because there's so many people are trying to do the same thing. So it's really important to find your niche and kind of figure out what kind of people are doing already. And then figuring out how you can kind of make that your own and then basically, just kind of find a problem that you can solve yourself.

Moderator: 2:20

And speaking of that, when you look towards your own career, what problem did you see and what niche do you see that actually I can tap into that and I can become one of the verbose follow people on TikTok?

Michael Le: 2:30

Oh, yeah, for me, I feel like there wasn't a lot of Asian creators. So I thought that was really important to kind of like be a good representative of that community. And me having a background of a dancer, I thought that there wasn't enough performances on, you know, social media in general. So I kind of became one of the first dancers on social media. And my thing that I really cracked down on was kind of like performing in public. So I did a lot of public performances in like random places like Walmart or at the mall, escalators, elevators, you know, random stuff. And I think that that was like an eye catching thing, because a lot of people were like, Oh, this is different. This is something that I've never seen before. And it was, you know, entertaining, so I was able to kind of find that niche and then kind of expand from there. Yeah.

Moderator: 3:16

And it's not surprising to me, they became so big on TikTok, because now we all associate TikTok with dancing videos, but the fact that you saw it as something new just shows you had a good eye for it. Yeah. So now we're gonna go towards the audience. So first time, don't be like the eagerness. So yeah, the microphone there, please.

Audience member: 3:33

Hi. Can you hear me? Yes, you can. Hi, I'm Olga from social data. I was wondering what do you find inspiration for your creatives? Is it important for you to know all the new hot trends on TikTok? What hashtags even to use? What sounds to use in your videos to help your videos go viral? And your tools maybe that you might be using?

Michael Le: 3:55

Well, I think it's important for any platform that you're try to hop on you kind of you have to be a part of the community itself, right. So if you're going to make content on TikTok, you have to know the audience that you're speaking to. So the more that you kind of like, absorb the content from TikTok, you'll learn from there, kind of like what you like, you know, for me, I've always kind of, again, looked at what the platform's offering in terms of content in terms of what creators are in my space, and then kind of adapting like, Okay, this is working for them. There's already people that are kind of doing it. So you can kind of look at their successes and their failures, and you kind of take from that and learn from it. So hashtags, I don't feel like are as important, but I think it's more of the platforms that you kind of are on so TikTok and YouTube Shorts are the two biggest platforms right now that I feel like the algorithm is really juicy. YouTube Shorts, especially in the last month I just started posting shorts on there. And I was able to gain I think like a quarter of a million followers on the shlep (?) family channel. So I feel like taking advantage of the platforms and being kind of like early is also really, really big kind of like key important thing factor to kind of consider as well. But yeah, definitely kind of like absorbing. So I'll give you an example if you're a cooking creator, so you want to be a chef, right? It could be any any kind of like niche. But if you find your niche that you really want to kind of head towards, there should be about five or 10 creators that you could probably look towards, that are in that same niche. And then you kind of like look at and you analyse that content, you kind of see, okay, what are they doing? How are they formatting it what kind of like structure they have, and you can kind of grasp from all of that, and then kind of make it in your own. So that's kind of like my process for being inspired from new content and how I can build off of it. Great. Yeah.

Moderator: 5:44

Thanks very much. And next question. Over there,

Audience member: 5:47

So Michael, my name is Axel from Toronto, I'm a please. fellow dancer as well. Hey, what's up actually, do you know Mike Song? Yeah, he's married to our friend Addy Chan. So we ...performers actually. So I just wanted to show you this because at least in my question, okay, cool. We create software for performers, basically, it's formation management, so you can send them rehearsals ahead of time. So everybody's prepared, right? No more pen and paper, no shoe on the floor anymore. Water bottle. So my question for you is: What's next for the underrepresented performer and creator out there? What do you think will be the next platform? Is it TIKTOK? That's giving us access to reviews and tonnes of music that's licenced or something else?

Michael Le: 6:25

I think I think it's still TikTok, for sure. TikTok and YouTube Shorts. I think that there's a lot of untapped potential there that hasn't really, we're still kind of figuring out and navigating. I think YouTube is still going to be king and then TikTok, of course, it still works. I don't think we should try to change or reinvent the wheel. I think it's already kind of going and it's working for a lot of people. Thank you. Yeah, for dancers, I still feel like it's still there. In terms of what type of content it really depends. And that's where you have to kind of find out because I know that back then I used to do like a lot of professional concept videos. And that doesn't really work now, you know, and then I started figuring out like, okay, maybe two years ago, it didn't work. But now it's coming back because people are adapting to new types of content. So for me, as a dancer, I'm doing now like mini concert videos. It's not like a two, three minute video. But you know, it's smaller. It's vertical format, you know, I'm doing a little bit more tracking, I'm adding VFX, adding things that people haven't seen before to keep it new and fresh, pretty much. Thank you. Yeah.

Moderator: 7:25

And speaking of YouTube, was it YouTube, where you started your career online? And when you started, did you join for fun? Or did you think I really want to make a go of this and make it a career in the future?

Michael Le: 7:34

I had, it was both, you know, so I was inspired by an OG YouTuber, Ryan Higa. He was like, you know, one of the OG content creators in my day. And I saw that they made a career out of doing what they loved. And I think is really important that if you want to do social media, as a career, or you want to kind of build off of it, it's really important that your passion comes first. Because this is a long game, I think a lot of people start rushing. And they think that this is like a one year thing when in reality, this is a 5, 10 year, 20 year thing. So whatever you build on your foundation is really, really important about who you are, because you can burn out. And that's how you lead to burnout. So for me, I was like, alright, what are my core values, is dancing, it's family, it's having fun, and you kind of see that in my content. And I think that's really important to make sure you kind of follow and stick through that. And everything else is just kind of like you know, learning day by day, how you can get improve on yourself and not really compare yourself to like, you know, others.

Moderator: 8:32

Speaking to your family it's great to your family here as well. So everyone say hi to your family might recognise him from your video sister, my mom right here. And so we'll go to another question from the audience you'd like to connect? Yep, the lady there in the yellow or green.

Audience member: 8:46

Hi, thank you. I wanted to ask how you how differently you produce content for TikTok versus Instagram? And how would you comment on these platforms?

Michael Le: 8:56

Um, Instagram personally is a little bit harder for me to kind of figure out. I feel like YouTube shorts, Instagram and TikTok are honestly very similar in how the algorithm works. Some content is different from others. But I think overall, attention and watch time is really, really key for every single platform. So if it's good content in general, it'll work on there. I think it's really hard to say because every niche is different. But I think that for me, I make content for YouTube Shorts and TikTok, specifically, and that kind of just repost that onto YouTube or Instagram for Instagram Reels.

Moderator: 9:35

Thank you. And the fact that you have millions and millions of followers shows the power of social media. So I wanted to ask you what is the power of social media mean to you?

Michael Le: 9:44

Oh, I mean, it's everything. I think it's it's been such a game changer just, in everyone's lives but even mine, like I was like, honestly, it's completely changed my life. Like I think that people fail to realise you can learn any skill, you can interact with anyone. And you can have, you can create your own opportunity with social media and it's just there for you to kind of like take advantage of or not, you know, so great. Yeah.

Moderator: 10:07

And you're taking advantage of ... another question from the audience, who would like to go next?

Audience member: 10:14

Hi. Yeah. My name Anastasia. Yeah, I have a short question. What do you think about augmented reality on social media? Actually, TikTok? Yeah. What does it say? about augmented reality? Yeah. Something like filter, AR filter? Yeah. And etc.

Michael Le: 10:36

Filters. Filters. Yeah. Well, um, I think that filters. I mean, it's crazy. I think once you figure out, it's hard to say honestly, for me, I mean, I've know that there's a lot of stories and filters and things like that to like, interact. Um, I know that TikTok uses live filters in the live is trends. So I think it's there. I think it's still being improved on and I think as technology kind of progresses, that's going to be more and more kind of like in our in our social media, in our world. But I mean, I think with that one, it's just, it's not fully there yet. Everyone isn't fully, you know, adapting into it yet, but it's getting there. Yeah.

Moderator: 11:20

Thanks. And as you mentioned earlier, there's a big difference today between being a content creator today compared to a few years ago, do you find there's a pressure these days to not only produce content, but to also have your own side business and other extreme stream of revenue? For example, you have your own company now joystick as well?

Michael Le: 11:36

Yeah. Oh, man, it's so important. I think as a creator, the more stress you have on it being your only source of revenue is definitely is definitely a lot harder on your mental when you kind of like have to create because it's like, oh, it's now a job. It's like, I have to do it. But I think when you kind of figure out your niche, and you figure out your kind of your wave, being able to expand from that, and having other sources of course, starting business, we're already seeing creators doing it like Logan Paul with like prime or with manual festivals with Mr. Beast, I think it's, I think it's amazing what they're doing. And it's really important that you're able to start branching out, when you feel like you're ready to add in terms of content. I mean, it's completely changed, I feel like back then I just made it for fun. And now I feel like we are all kind of our own media companies. You know, I have a team now running where it's like, I have a whole discord channel, just straight of one on one connections of every single teammate that I have. And I have, I'm running four channels on YouTube. Now I'm running two Tiktok channels, you know, travelling, so it's just a lot more that I have to kind of like time management. And yeah, I feel like it's a lot more of a business sense than just posting.

Moderator: 12:45

sounds like you're very, very busy. And so it goes to another question from the audience. Um, yeah, I'm the girl over there in thewhite please.

Audience member: 12:55

Hi, nice to meet you. My name is Mi. And I'm a head of influencer marketing for a tech company. So my questions come more from a brand side. So I work with a lot of content creators, and we have success as the brands on Instagram and YouTube. However, when it comes to TikTok, we still need to play the game better. So if you have any advice or suggestions for brands who want to work more with creators, yeah, to be more successful, because on TikTok it really hard for brands to do content with TikTok. The algorithm gonna ban it. So normally the views not good. So do you have any tips for that?

Michael Le: 13:37

What what is your brand?

Audience member: 13:39

Oh, so we, our company name, Elsa Speak, educational mobile app, help people to speak better English.

Michael Le: 13:48

Okay, cool. Yeah, I think it's important, um, find find the lower or mid tier creators, I think it's important to kind of find your balance so you can kind of work your way up budget wise, and you're able to expand across more creators, I think that the up and coming creators are, it's good to give them opportunities because they're, they're a lot more hungry for it as well. And you're able to kind of expand more. So I think it really depends on what type of trader you're looking for. I think the the people that probably for your company specifically could be the personality ones, whether they're talking a lot or they're giving stories, storytelling, those types of creators instead of like the trend based, I think those might be more beneficial for your company than others. But it's really just looking for those types of content and then being able to just reach out to them. Yeah,

Moderator: 14:38

thanks for question. And actually speaking of companies so Joy secure company, for I'm sure there are a lot of Michael Le fans in the audience for for those who don't know anything about Joystick, what is it? How does it work? I want inspired you to set it off.

Michael Le: 14:49

Yeah. So I've been a gamer my whole life, not in content, but just in my personal life. And I think that when I got into web3, with the whole, you know, crypto nfts situation, I learned about this thing called Play to earn. And I think that for me being an early mover in the space that I feel like it's going to come no matter what, especially in gaming is so key for me. So I was like this is... no one's doing it myself, you know, give it a shot. And I was able to basically create this thing called joystick. It's the next gaming ecosystem, where I'm going to be teaching people how to make money playing video games, you know, it's like a dream job that I feel like a lot of people are waiting on. And I feel like the time is coming, it's not now. But in the next six months and a year, two years, there's already people that I've worked with that are making strides where they're supporting their families already across the country, you know, just playing video games. So I think that's really amazing. And for me, it's really just educating the the web to the general masses right now about what the opportunity is going to come about with gaming with the NFT market. You know, all that stuff is really, really cool. And I think that a lot of people have their misconceptions about it. You know, there's obviously a lot, we're still early in it. So there's going to be a lot of kind of wrongdoings in this space until we kind of figure out how to really navigate, but I think we're Yeah, so it's something that I'm really, really passionate about and really excited for. And we're starting off with educating people about what the west face is about. Getting into the games that are coming up in the next two to three years. And then pretty much just teaching people how to become Esports players, streamers, and yeah, just kind of getting all these. Great. I

Moderator: 16:29

I think we should have a moment for Michael's necklace, which has a joystick on it. It's most lengthening I've ever seen, and I love it. I wish I had my own. So yeah, so go to the audience. Now for another question. Does anyone have one? over their please?

Audience member: 16:50

Hello, yeah. Can you hear? Yes, yes. So can you please give your opinion on quality versus quantity? Is it better to upload less but like a high calibre content? or upload more with like a medium?

Michael Le: 17:07

It depends on where you're at with your social media career. Would you say that... Are you just starting off? Or are you already kind of going through it, you kind of know what you want to do? What was your vibe? You're just starting. I think it's important. If you're just starting social media and you're starting to become a creator, it's important to just post. I think that you learn the most, and you grow the fastest when you're just posting and experimenting. So if you're starting is the best because you have no risk. If if a video does good, it will do good. And if it doesn't do good, no one's gonna see it. So it doesn't even matter. You're you're learning for yourself. And for me, I used to post like four to eight videos a day on TikTok, just kind of like experimenting, what trends work, what kind of like fitted my persona. And from there, if something didn't work, I'd take it off, you know, learn from it, figure out why it didn't work, and then kind of go from there. But once you kind of figure out the process, then you can kind of like double down on what works. And then you can start creating higher quality content or whatever else. But I think if you just start, start, wherever you feel like your your opportunity can happen, you know, so if you only have a phone, start with the phone, you know, just kind of experiment with it. Once you have brand deals coming in or something starts happening, then you can start expand expanding, buy a camera, get someone you know, work with an editor start, you know, expanding whatever route that is. But I think it's important just just posting don't be too hard on yourself, especially in the beginning. Yeah.

Moderator: 18:38

Thanks for that. And now if you could imagine in a parallel universe where social media doesn't exist, first of all, I wouldn't be able to devise. But what do you think your career would be at this stage? One thing you'd be interested in if it never existed? Obviously, you'd be into the gaming but in general, like, is there any other careers you ever had in mind?

Michael Le: 18:54

Um, I mean, before social media, I was a professional dancer. So I'll probably just be I would say the dancer, choreographer, that kind of thing.

Moderator: 19:03

Yeah, I would love to see some of those dances. So now go back to the audience. Does anyone else have a question? Yeah. Over there, please.

Audience member: 19:14

Hi, you were just mentioning that you just to get started experiment a little bit. But my question is, then if you want to post content for a brand, which stands for high quality, how can you ensure that that it doesn't spoil the brand reputation? Or how can you experiment then, if that has a bigger impact on the whole brand? And is there any recommendation you can give?

Michael Le: 19:37

In today's kind of like, I guess, culture or time, high quality does work too. I think it's just a matter of can you make it engaging and this is less than just quality is more of quality of storytelling. You know, how can you storytell through your content, whether it's 15 seconds or 15 minutes, the more that you can captivate and Tell your message through that specific amount of time. That's where you find the most success. I know it's very broad. But it's really important that the story is the most important thing first, because I've seen low quality stuff go off, I've seen high quality stuff go off, it's just a matter of is the actual story compelling. And if you're, if you're prone, if your promo videos or whatever you're kind of promoting out and putting out is, it's entertaining, and it's, it's good. And you know, the message is coming across very clear to where a 50 year old or a five year old can understand it, then you kind of figure out, you know, that in between of what works for your brand and as a creator, and you can kind of just go from there. Great. Yeah.

Moderator: 20:37

Thank you. And I think we have a question over there. Get the microphone over there, please. Yep, behind you. Yeah, thanks.

Audience member: 20:47

Hi, there, I ask about your creative process, like what do you do when you try to create your own content? Do you batch create? And what can you suggest to avoid burnout for a creator?

Michael Le: 20:55

Um, oh, man, I, it's a good question. I, for me, I have honestly kind of looked at other creators that inspired me first, see, kind of like the content that they're doing and see what kind of like, entices me, you know, so I wouldn't kind of go just what's working, and it's like, oh, let me just do this, this and this. If it doesn't really resonate with me as a creator, then I won't do it. It's important that you do the things that build yourself as a brand. And that also that you enjoy watching, you know, the more that you enjoy doing your own content, the more that you kind of find your niche and build on that. In terms of burnout, that really just goes down to, if you're actually enjoying it or not, you know, like for me, I could watch anime all day, I'll never burn out on that. Because I enjoy, you know, dancing, same thing. But if I were to do something that isn't making me happy, then that's where you experience burnout. So it's really just a self kind of question that you have to ask yourself. Is this what I want to do? Or is this not? Yeah.

Moderator: 21:57

Thank you. And you have any questions on this side of the room? Oh, back over there at the back, please. Yeah, the microphone tourism. Yeah, behind you that. Thank you.

Audience member: 22:10

Hello, and thank you for such an insightful conversation, Michael. I'm Maria Priyanka, from soft service global IT company with Ukrainian roots. And my question is quite simple. I have to make content viral in Do you batch create? And what can you suggest to avoid burnout for TikTok. What's your advice on it?

Michael Le: 22:28

Oh, man, it's such a broad question. Because so hard, but I think it goes down to a few things. If you're starting with nothing, the cool thing is that [on] TikTok, YouTube shorts, all of these shortform platforms, you don't even need a following to have something basically go viral. Right. And that's, I think that's beautiful. Because I mean, for me, I was literally gaining like a million followers every single week, when I first hopped on. And it was, it was crazy to see that, you know, it gives you an opportunity. And when it goes down to is storytelling, trends, sounds and types of content, you know, so with the sounds, there's so many viral sounds that pop off of TikTok that can help boost your video. And if it goes along with the content, whether it's just background music, or it's actually playing into the trend, it'll one that'll help one virality. The second thing is what types of trends that kind of works for your niche. And building off of that something that people like to do is storyteller with series things that work, you know, so a key thing is that if you basically just experiment and you do 10 different videos, and one of them does the best, double down on that, and then experiment with that one, you know, and then kind of expand from there. I think it's a key of those. And then let's see, music, experimentation of trends. Experimentation, I mean, it's honestly, it's a lot of experimentation, you know, it's hard for me to just say like, this is gonna go viral, because every person is different. And everything works for one person may not work for another. So that's really when it goes down to that's why I say experiment the most. Because that's when you find what works for you. And basically just building off of that, so yeah,

Moderator: 24:18

thanks. And actually speaking of trends, how do you stay ahead of your competition to make sure that you get on the trends first, and you make them your own?

Michael Le: 24:26

I'm at a point now where I personally, I feel like it's good to make your own kind of like road right? So for me, like there's now so many dancers that have done what I've, I've kind of done in terms of content that I'm like, Okay, how can I separate myself from them so that I can kind of build my own thing and for me, it was like storytelling with my dancing, maybe VFX adding cool visuals or high quality you know, I think that if you want to, if you want to really find your niche, it's again, finding what works In the market already, because realistically, everyone here wants to do something that someone else is already doing is already examples out there. So how you make it your own is by experimenting from what works, but not drifting apart too, too much. But that's really kind of what I do. Yeah.

Moderator: 25:16

And at what stage of your social media career, did you realise? Actually, I can do this full time and make it my full career?

Michael Le: 25:22

When I first started really first start, yeah, no, I saw, I literally saw other people do it. And I was like, if they can do it, I can't do and it's really just about believing yourself and trusting the process. You know, again, this is a longer game, when I first started, I was like, it's not a matter of how long it takes, it's just, I just have to kind of continue doing it. And after three years, or four years, technically, that's when I started having like, it really pop off. So those four years, I was just kind of building my arm on my own craft, and I was still, you know, live with my parents, of course, are still doing school, having jobs and all of that stuff. And by 2019, that's when it really took off. I think a lot of people think that like, you know, overnight successes come overnight, but it's actually like five or 10 years before that, that really makes that person have the ability to do that, you know, so it's kind of a lot of mental work and kind of like reassuring yourself and not putting yourself value on numbers all the time, you know, so that I get really can't

Moderator: 26:19

wait time for one last question from the audience. And the lady there at the back. Oh, sorry. But due to this one, so you can have that one. And then we'll give us about their microphone. Thank you.

Audience member: 26:35

Thank you. Do you engage one on one with your audience?

Michael Le: 26:40

One on one. I mean, if I get story replies, you can reply that way. But I think that when you have a larger audience, it's easier to kind of find a platform that works that you can kind of just talk to them. Whether it's Discord, YouTube, TikTok, you kind of find your community and everyone's like, you know, you find that community of fans that are kind of similar. And that you're, if you say one thing, it kind of speaks to more than just one. So it's less than just one on one, but more of like, one to the community. Yeah.

Moderator: 27:15

Thank you. And last question, please.

Audience member: 27:19

Hello. So my question is also coming back from like a dancer and choreographer background, right? What was the transition, like coming from that community of being a dance and choreographer and making videos? And then we've jumped into this whole different world of TikTok influencing businesses? Did you go through any hurdles?

Michael Le: 27:39

What was that? Like? No, definitely, I think that I had a lot of pushback from the community in terms of people because they're like, Oh, this isn't real dancing. This is, you know, to viral or whatever. And I felt like dancing in general, is just like a language that we all are able to speak together. And it was fun, it's fun, that's the purpose of dance, you know, they connect with each other. And for me, it was kind of just going against the grain and be like, No, this is, this is what I like to do. I think it's fun, I'm able to reach out to more people, and I get an opportunity from it. So I think it's just kind of like a lot of people are against change a lot of the time and for you, you have to be so confident about the vision that you see in the world that you're creating that you kind of just like, you know, now, now they're coming along years later, you know, so it's really just, you have to be the trendsetter. And in turn to follow your heart. So yeah, great.

Moderator: 28:30

Thank you. And very, very last question quickly, what's next for my colleagues?

Michael Le: 28:35

Who are more content, I'm really cracking down the system to where I can be able to have four YouTube channels to be able to post more content, dance more and find my passions of what's important to me. So that's still you know, dancing, maybe it's acting in the future, integrating acting into the content, getting more family continent, and that's just expanding, growing what I do already already, but just more of it,

Moderator: 28:58

Great, so thanks so much, Mike, and thanks to the audience for all your really good questions. Like can they go this way? Yep. Thank you. Thank you guys.